#pypy IRC log for Thursday, 2012-02-23

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kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 1107c7b2f08065 15/pypy/module/cppyy/test/Makefile: rules for CINT dictionary generation and easier use00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 1150add258af6d 15/pypy/module/cppyy/interp_cppyy.py: resolve a conflict with _multiprocessing (both used the name handle that ended up on W_Root)00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 11d5c9c43ebf5a 15/pypy/module/cppyy/test/test_zjit.py: do not test for fast path if CINT is the back-end as it does not support ffi calls00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 113061664dc973 15/pypy/module/cppyy/test/overloads_LinkDef.h: required link definitions for CINT00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 117baa0df07b9a 15/pypy/module/cppyy/src/cintcwrapper.cxx: implement calling of global functions00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 116884cdf7f445 15/pypy/module/cppyy/converter.py: cleanup00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 11bffd3860d4ee 15/pypy/module/cppyy/capi/: function to identify the back-end (to be used for testing only)00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 11ac8bc1fdaec0 15/pypy/module/cppyy/test/stltypes_LinkDef.h: required link definitions for CINT backend00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 114461e932bcc6 15/pypy/module/cppyy/pythonify.py: lazier does it00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 1175af268bf2bc 15/pypy/module/cppyy/test/std_streams_LinkDef.h: required linkdef for CINT00:41
kenaan_12wlav reflex-support 112d378037bef0 15/pypy/module/cppyy/: bring CINT backend to the level of the Reflex backend00:41
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amaury_Read on CPython bug tracker (issue2377):01:10
amaury_"When is PyPy going to be the reference implementation again?  Then we’ll have no speed issues"01:10
Alex_Gaynor"ha ha only serious" ;)01:10
mwhudsonheh, that use of the word 'again' is slightly funny01:11
Alex_Gaynormwhudson: it's not saying when will it be the reference implementation for the second (or third) time01:11
Alex_Gaynorit's "Remind me again"01:11
mwhudsonAlex_Gaynor: yes, i realize01:11
mwhudsonwhen i read it for the second time01:11
Alex_GaynorAh, ok :)01:11
mwhudson<- channel token uk english speaker01:12
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bbot23Success: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-32/builds/106701:31
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fijalmwhudson: heh01:46
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-macosx-x86-32/builds/81501:46
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fijalmwhudson: are you coming to pycon by chance?01:47
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/73202:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/201302:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-macosx-x86-64/builds/37502:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-win-x86-32/builds/40402:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/125502:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-64/builds/71602:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-Ojit-no-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/90002:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-32/builds/155902:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-64/builds/83802:00
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/73202:01
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-macosx-x86-64/builds/37502:01
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fijaljustinpeel: hi02:01
justinpeelhi02:01
fijalAlex_Gaynor: want a quest?02:15
Alex_Gaynorfijal: find the magical gems?02:17
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: run test_compiler -k test_funccals from pypy/interpreter/astcompiler02:25
fijaland find out why it's doing list comprehension02:25
mwhudsonfijal: no :/02:30
Alex_Gaynorfijal: what?02:31
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bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-32/builds/155902:58
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bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-Ojit-no-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/90003:00
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-app-level-linux-x86-64/builds/71603:01
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IngenDear PyPy, people. You have heard of Kickstarter, right?03:04
Alex_GaynorYes03:04
IngenWhy not try to get funding on there? PyPy for Python 3 would be really great.03:04
Alex_GaynorWe already have a fundraiser for Py3k.03:05
IngenOn kickstarter?03:05
Alex_GaynorWe can't use kickstarter because they require you to be American, which not all our developers are.03:05
Alex_GaynorAlso, we're a registered non-profit in the US, and I'm not sure we can offer the tax-deductability if we take donations through there.03:05
IngenThere's got to be someway to let people know...03:06
Alex_GaynorLet people know what?03:07
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IngenThat you need donations03:07
Alex_GaynorWell, I think people are aware, because we've raised quite a bit of money, and blogged about it regularly.03:07
Alex_Gaynorhttp://pypy.org/py3donate.html03:08
IngenRight, but you won't meet your goal by March. I was hoping more people would see the importance of PyPy for the future of Python.03:10
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Alex_GaynorWell, we're more than happy to look at more ways to publicize it, but ATM we're not going to move it to kickstarter.03:11
IngenAnyway, that's all I have to say. Keep up the good work.03:11
Alex_GaynorThanks!03:11
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bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-32/builds/125503:12
fijalAlex_Gaynor: weird03:15
Alex_Gaynorfijal: the guy who dropped in?03:16
fijalyes03:16
Alex_GaynorYeah, a little, but he was excited for us, so it's all good.03:16
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fijalyes :)03:16
fijalAlex_Gaynor: did you figure out my quest?03:16
Alex_Gaynorfijal: no, your command didn't even run any tests for me03:17
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fijaluh?03:19
fijalin astcompiler run test_compiler.py03:19
fijaland there is test_funccalls03:19
Alex_Gaynorhttp://paste.pocoo.org/show/555319/03:20
Alex_Gaynorah, typo03:20
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Alex_Gaynorsorry, what the heck am I looking for?03:21
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: why this calls code for list comprehension03:24
fijalyou can put a pdb in _listcomp_generator in codegen.py03:25
Alex_Gaynoruhh, no idea03:25
Alex_Gaynorpff, one of these args is reprsented by a list comprehension03:27
Alex_Gaynorwtf?03:27
Alex_Gaynora list comprehension over `l`, where?03:27
Alex_Gaynoroh, it's from some applevel code03:28
Alex_Gaynornot the code in the test03:28
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Alex_Gaynorthe listrepr code is Pure pPython03:28
Alex_Gaynor"easy"03:29
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: :]03:48
weirdodid the damn thing compile, finally?03:48
Action: weirdo looks...03:48
weirdoah, running tests03:49
kenaan_12fijal speedup-list-comprehension 1125b085bcabfe 15/: look how list comprehension can be sped up03:56
fijalAlex_Gaynor: next_instr is r_longlong03:58
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kenaan_12fijal speedup-list-comprehension 113846122a4dd5 15/pypy/rlib/jit.py: disable this check for now04:12
kenaan_12fijal speedup-list-comprehension 118b1f69191c51 15/pypy/interpreter/astcompiler/codegen.py: make sure we create only one list04:12
fijalAlex_Gaynor: cool04:13
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/201304:13
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/2014 [py3k]04:13
fijalwe should maybe implement __length_hint__04:13
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fijallet's see if it got any faster04:20
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bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-win-x86-32/builds/40404:25
kenaan_12fijal speedup-list-comprehension 1170d8c227d622 15/pypy/: merge default04:39
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weirdo'pypy' is not recognized as an internal or external command,04:53
weirdooperable program or batch file.04:53
weirdofail :(04:53
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fijalweirdo: forgotten .exe?05:22
weirdofijal, probably path05:23
weirdoneed like build-dir\pypy05:23
weirdoalso05:23
weirdoPATH has semicolon seprators on win3205:23
weirdofeel free to test it when done fixin'05:24
weirdoi have some spare RAM left05:24
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-64/builds/83805:24
fijalweirdo: I'm not fixing that right now05:26
weirdosure, just sayin'05:26
fijalk05:26
weirdoalso stdio tests are snafu 05:28
weirdostill05:28
weirdoless tests appear to fail now, great good05:28
fijal:]05:28
weirdofreebsd hates my guts with its broken terminfo05:30
weirdoi mean termcap05:30
weirdowho the hell uses termcap in 201205:30
fijalfreebsd is hardly 201205:30
weirdofor servers it's great05:31
idnartermcarp06:04
idnarI have some really convoluted stuff in my shell startup scripts for working around broken terminal stuff now :(06:05
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bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-linux-x86-32/builds/2014 [py3k]06:32
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arigatohttp://www.bscmsrc.eu/sites/default/files/ics056-gajinov.pdf08:10
arigatoa paper that is also approaching the STM problem from the same side as I do08:11
arigatoand it's about the game Quake :-)08:11
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mikefcarigato, I'm mighty impressed with the pace/performance of pypy STM dev.08:42
Action: mikefc doesn't know where all the pypy devs find the time.08:43
ronnymy hypothesis is, they dont find it, they generate it with the gravity of cappability08:44
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arigato:-)08:57
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kenaan_12bivab ppc-jit-backend 11d2db5350e2aa 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/: Add missing get/set interiorfield_raw operations09:46
kenaan_12bivab ppc-jit-backend 116af6f2607858 15/pypy/jit/backend/ppc/: (edelsohn, bivab) fix jump conditions in malloc_cond and cond_call_gc_wb to jump on equality09:46
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kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 11df24c4bac7bc 15/pypy/rpython/rtyper.py: Trying out a version of the RTyper that runs every block in its own transaction.10:21
ronnyarigato: sounds scary from gut feeling is my gut feeling right or wrong?10:23
arigatoronny: judge yourself from the checkin.  that should be enough for the complete rtyping step10:23
arigato(I started from rtyping because it's the easiest step, probably)10:24
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lucianarigato: does block also mean suites, or just scope-introducing constructs?10:27
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kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 115c8abeef1057 15/pypy/translator/goal/targetpypystandalone.py: Auto-enable the 'transaction' module if --stm is specified.10:30
arigatolucian: a "block" is a block in the flow graphs10:30
lucianarigato: ah, ok. that's sounds closer to what a programmer might semantically consider a byte-sized chunk of code10:31
lucians/that's/that/10:31
ronnyarigato: so pypy-c-stm will be able to parallelize block ops?10:31
arigato?10:31
ronnyhmm, maybe im completely off atm10:31
arigatoronny: I think right now it should be able to parallelize the translation process' rtyping phase10:32
lucianronny: i would guess it would move the boundaries from where the GIL placed them (every few bytecodes) to there10:32
arigatobut I need to translate a pypy-stm with more modules in order to try to run translate.py on it10:32
lucianah, that's even more interesting10:32
luciandogfooding at its finest10:32
ronnyarigato: any idea how much work puting in the jit will be?10:33
arigatoI think there is confusion between what the process I hacked does, and the underlying pypy-stm10:33
arigatothe process I hacked does translation, yes, but that's just an example10:33
arigatoany program with a similar control flow would be as easy to fix10:34
arigatoronny: I don't really know, but maybe not that much10:34
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arigatoit's a matter of adding the calls to the read and write barriers, and then having optimization steps to remove these calls as often as possible10:35
ronnysounds like stuff will be awesome soonish10:35
arigato:-)10:35
arigatoit's possible that the 3x-slow-down factor I measured so far will increase in the jit10:36
arigatobecause the jit removes all frame handling code, which is not using stm guards so far10:36
arigato(because the frame is made thread-local)10:36
arigatoin other words the jit removes mostly things that didn't need stm guards, and keep things that need stm guards10:37
arigato(but that's all guessing)10:38
ronnyhm, random tought, are there any kinds of datastructures, that can reduce the conflict potentials on transactions that communicate with io or each other?10:38
lucianronny: immutable ones :)10:41
arigatoyes10:42
arigatowe need to do something about it10:42
arigatothe next step will be looking at the annotation example10:43
arigatoit's more delicate because there the blocks are discovered dynamically10:43
arigatowith a few big dicts containing everything10:44
arigatowhich are updated with new information all the time10:44
ronnyarigato: im mainly interested in things that will reduce conflict potentials in io loop vs the transactions that requested the io10:45
arigatounsure what that means10:46
ronnyit would be really nice if the io loop was a inevidable transaction that would not at all effect other transactions abiloty to run10:46
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arigatowhy an I/O loop in the first place?10:46
ronnyas far as i understood anythin that does io stops other transactions atm10:46
lucianmost other STMs simply ban IO within transactions10:46
lucianronny: i believe the IO one just wins any conflict10:47
arigatolucian: yes10:47
lucianronny: if the other transaction doesn't interfere, it'll run happily10:47
ronnyso "all" one has to do is kill conflicts between the io transactions and the "grunt" transactions10:48
arigatowell I/O transactions should be regarded as reverting to the GIL10:48
arigatoso you have to carefully place I/O10:48
arigatoe.g. if transactions end very soon after doing I/O, it's fine10:49
ronnyarigato: but transactions wating on epoll/select could take some time if no new io happens10:51
arigatoyes, that's why epoll needs special support10:51
arigatothe call to epoll_wait() occurs outside transactions10:51
arigatoI'm unsure how to do it with select()10:52
arigatoepoll is great because one thread can be blocked on epoll_wait() while another thread adds more fd's to the set, and it works10:53
ronnyselect just does its thing with the current list10:53
ronnynothing new an be added while it waits10:53
lucianif it's only fast with epoll and kqueue, that would be reasonable10:54
lucian(so just do select inside transactions)10:54
arigatoright now I'm worrying about Linux only, so epoll is fine10:54
ronnyhow about a concept of outside-of-transaction foreign calls, where the initial result is stored, so transactions using them become repeatable?10:54
lucianarigato: sure, i'm just saying that if only the fast IO works with fast pypy, that'd be ok10:54
arigato:-)10:54
lucianronny: that'd require unbounded buffering, i think10:55
arigatoronny: yes, that would be some generalization of the current epoll hacks10:55
lucianbut i believe it's exactly what Haskell does10:55
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arigatohow exactly to communicate this from app-level is unclear10:55
ronnythat way select/poll/kqueue would be supportable rasonbly easy10:55
ronnyarigato: i tihnk its ok to cofine that to rpython for now10:56
arigatoyes10:56
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arigatohum, to clean up epoll I would need a way to say "I know that another thread is blocked in epoll_wait(); please wake it up now"11:02
ronnythat would need a signal fd i think11:02
ronnyight be misstaken11:03
Da_Blitzwouldnt a lock do it11:03
arigatowell it can be done with any random fd11:03
arigatowhat I'd ideally like is a way that doesn't feel like a hack :-I)11:03
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arigatoright now you could do it e.g. by creating a pair of fd's for a pipe, and adding the write end to epoll11:04
arigatoit will immediately trigger because we can write11:04
arigatobut indeed, you could also send a signal to the thread11:06
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arigatobut that's not safe I think11:06
arigatoe.g. what if the signal arrives because the other thread is actually waiting11:06
Da_Blitzwhat would the thread be doing? i thought it would be blocking on the read end11:06
arigatoit would *probably* be blocked in epoll_wait()11:07
arigatobut of course you have no way to ensure that it has reached the epoll_wait syscall11:07
Da_Blitzso to clarify, this is a case of 2 epolls with a common FD?11:08
arigatono11:08
arigatowhat does that mean?11:09
Da_Blitzyou create an epoll object, then you create another11:09
Da_Blitzthen add the fd to both epolls11:09
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antocunipff11:19
antocuniis there a way to have an iterable set of weakref in rpython?11:19
antocuniRWeakKeyDictionary does not work because I cannot iterate over it11:19
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arigatoDa_Blitz: no, there is only one epoll object11:56
arigatoantocuni: in objspace/std/typeobject.py, we use just a list of weakref.ref()11:57
arigatoit's good enough for that use case11:57
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antocuniarigato: I would like to keep a list of all opened _io.IOBase streams12:20
antocuniso that we can flush all of them when we exit12:20
antocuniif I just append a weakref to a list, we will have an always-growing list12:21
arigatodo the same as module/_file12:21
antocuniI cannot12:21
antocunibecause there it keeps a a dict of the underlying rlib.streamio objects12:22
antocuniwhich are removed from the dict when the applevel object is closed12:22
antocuniI need to keep references to the applevel objects themselves12:22
arigatoconfused12:22
antocuniwhat is the source of the confusion?12:23
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arigatoa weak dict of the form {weakref(iobase): iobase} would never work, to12:24
arigatotoo12:24
arigatoso I'm confused by what you're trying to do12:24
antocuniideally, I would like a weakset12:25
antocunior something12:25
antocuniuhm12:25
arigato= a weakdict whose values are None?12:25
antocuniyes12:25
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antocunibut RWeakKeyDictionary does not support iterating over all the keys12:26
arigatoyes12:26
arigatobut I still think the typeobject solution would work12:26
arigatolook more closely12:26
arigatoit doesn't grow the list forever12:26
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arigatoit looks for now-free spots12:26
antocuniah, I see12:26
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arigatoyou can probably improve this by keeping e.g. a last-looking-at index12:27
arigatoinstead of looking from the start every time12:27
arigatobut that seems enough12:27
antocunibut this means that opening N files is O(N**2) 12:27
arigatoit's possible to improve12:28
arigatoyou can even create your own class in rlib12:28
arigatoand use it also for typeobject.py12:28
arigatoe.g. by having clean-up phases not every insertion12:29
arigatobut depending on how large the list already is12:29
arigatoi.e. amortized12:29
antocuniyes, that might work12:29
arigatoalternatively, improve RWeakKeyDictionary to add a popitem() operation12:30
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arigato:-)12:30
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antocuniwriting the wrapper around a list of weakrefs sounds easier :-)12:32
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kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 118b5bdb3aeda9 15/pypy/translator/stm/test/test_transform.py: Add comment12:58
kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 1164b23c237c68 15/pypy/translator/stm/test/targetdemo.py: Add a failing test12:58
kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 11077ddb94d35b 15/pypy/: Fix pointer comparison between two non-NULL objects.12:58
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fijalhi13:31
fijalarigato: did you fix the build?13:33
stakkarshi13:33
arigatohi13:34
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arigatofijal: last night's succeeded, yes (37fb24cc3dde )13:35
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fijalhttp://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-64/builds/248/steps/translate/logs/stdio13:36
fijalno JIT 64bit13:36
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arigatobah, the 'signal' module kills stm right now because of the getfield-raw it's doing13:37
fijalthe signal module is obscure13:38
arigatofijal: ah bah13:38
Action: arigato fixes13:38
arigatosorry sorry13:38
Topic changed on #pypy by fijal!fijal@c-76-120-66-180.hsd1.co.comcast.net: :]13:39
fijalno13:39
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fijalthat wasn't what I was trying to do13:39
Topic changed on #pypy by fijal!fijal@c-76-120-66-180.hsd1.co.comcast.net: PyPy, a fast and compliant python interpreter | IRC logs: http://tismerysoft.de/pypy/irc-logs/pypy/ | it was few yaks too late13:39
rndbityaks? :D13:39
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arigato:-)13:40
fijalhttp://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/yak_shaving13:40
rndbitu live - u learn13:41
fijalrndbit: a very important term on #pypy13:42
kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 11f4469915accd 15/pypy/translator/stm/localtracker.py: Unifies the two detections of 'Constant' in this function.13:42
kenaan_12arigo default 11f3469e6103b2 15/pypy/rlib/: Test and fix: skip that test on 64-bit.13:42
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/733 [12arigo]13:42
fijalarigato: we don't have a special strategy for the list of Nones do we?13:44
fijala special list strategy13:44
fijal(we have a special optimization for RPython though)13:44
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arigatoyes13:45
arigatothat sounds rather pointless in Python (and to some extend in RPython too)13:45
arigato(but harder to avoid in RPython)13:45
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fijalright13:46
arigatouse list-of-chars as the strategy to have lists containing bools or Nones13:46
arigato:-)13:46
fijalwe don't have a list of chars either I think13:47
arigatothat's also a bit pointless13:49
arigatoimho13:49
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fijalyes, probably :)13:49
fijalat least very hard to explain "this is optimized"13:49
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arigatopom pom pom13:57
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fijalarigato: ?13:58
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arigatoI don't know what to do about the 'signal' module14:02
kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 117326ccf9874d 15/pypy/rpython/memory/gc/stmgc.py: Ignore calls to collect() for now14:02
kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 11a70cb92dc2e7 15/pypy/translator/stm/src_stm/: Change what is printed.  Now even non-debug builds can have logged the operation that caused the transaction to beco...14:02
kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 115501a1e8eba4 15/pypy/translator/stm/localtracker.py: merge heads14:02
kenaan_12arigo stm-gc 115c85b1a8c846 15/pypy/translator/goal/targetpypystandalone.py: Disable the signal module with stm for now.14:02
arigatoright now I've disabled it14:02
fijalkill it14:02
fijalwho needs signals :)14:02
fijalhm14:02
arigatoit's convenient that Ctrl-C would work :-)14:02
arigatoright now it doesn't14:02
fijalmaybe you can postpone any signal handling until the end of transaction?14:02
arigatoI guess it's sent to the main thread that is anyway just blocked14:03
fijalah yes14:03
fijalsignals won't be received by other threads14:03
fijalso there is probably no point in checking14:03
fijalok14:03
fijallet me rephrase the question14:03
arigatowell, no, it's far more complicated14:03
fijalhow do we make C-c work? is a different question14:03
fijalyes?14:03
arigatoas far as I know it's platform-dependent which thread(s) get outside signals14:04
exarkunCPython pretends that only the main thread can get them 14:04
exarkun(some of its pretending might take the form of platform-specific setup code to achieve that)14:04
arigatoexarkun: no, it has general code to achieve that14:05
exarkunPyPy presumably wants to emulate that14:05
arigatopypy does14:05
fijalexarkun: in STM you don't have user-visible threads14:05
exarkunfijal: yes?14:05
arigatoyes, it's a slightly different question for this reason14:05
fijalexarkun: threads in STM are an optimization14:06
fijalthat's not user-visible14:06
exarkunI guess I don't understand the question.14:06
arigatowe need to come up with new, reasonable semantics14:06
fijalexarkun: the question is how platform really handles that14:06
exarkun"Which transaction gets interrupted?"14:06
fijalexarkun: so we can do something smart14:06
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fijalno, it's a different level14:06
fijalwhich thread should check for a signal being there14:07
exarkunit sounds like there are two questions to me14:07
fijalok14:07
exarkunwhat Python-level semantics are desired, and how can that be implemented?14:07
fijalI think the first one is "like CPython"14:07
arigatofijal: yes, which thread checks at the OS level is one thing, but the harder question is indeed which semantics we want14:07
fijalarigato: you can do something obscure like a volatile thread-local14:07
fijalthat gets set for all threads14:08
arigatoyes, that's fine14:08
arigatobut let's focus on the semantics that we want14:08
ronnyexarkun: does twisted reconfigure how it gets signals?14:08
fijalyou abort all transactions but one, and that one gets C-ced?14:08
exarkunronny: Twisted installs signal handlers.  Is that what you're asking?14:08
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ronnyi14:09
arigatofijal: ah yes, good idea, and compatible with the fact that one thread may run an unabortable inevitable transaction14:09
ronnyso basically all event loops im aware of install some kind of handler for the signals14:09
fijalexarkun: can you explain how signal is delivered on say linux?14:09
arigatohum, you don't even need to abort the other transactions14:09
ronnyso ca we just have all normal signals just cause a transaction to start?14:10
exarkuniow, "handle a signal from the OS" is treated the same as any syscall14:10
fijalarigato: right it'll abort itself14:10
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fijalarigato: sounds like a bit too much work for now?14:10
fijalsince maybe we should consider JIT first14:10
arigatonot necessarily14:10
fijalok14:10
arigatoso we need to turn one thread inevitable if none is, and send the signal there14:11
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fijalarigato: I run this program http://paste.pocoo.org/show/555541/ with 10000 as a command line arg14:11
fijalwhy the external loop is not JIT compiled?14:11
arigatobecause we don't want the signal to be handled by an evitable transaction that gets later aborted14:11
fijalright14:12
fijalwell14:12
fijalhandling a signal makes it fairly inevitable14:12
arigatoyes, probably14:12
arigatofijal: I bet it is compiled as a bridge of the inner loop14:12
fijaloh indeed14:13
fijalthank you :)14:13
arigato:-)14:13
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fijalhahaha14:22
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arigatoyay, test1tm works14:42
arigatoit's the demo using epoll14:42
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arigatomeh, the demo doesn't work on cpython14:48
bbot24Failure: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/pypy-c-jit-linux-x86-64/builds/733 [12arigo]14:49
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amaury_FYI, on Windows signals handlers are called in a new thread15:08
amaury_specially created for this15:08
arigatoamaury_: that's still another level15:08
arigatothe real signal handler, both in pypy and cpython, just sets a flag somewhere15:09
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amaury_yes, you have to choose which transaction receives the signal15:09
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fijalarigato: list comprehension optimization is slightly trickier than I though ;-)15:15
antocunifijal: what is the idea?15:16
fijalantocuni: to do some sort of a bytecode trick to preallocate the list to the correct size15:17
fijaleither ast or bytecode15:17
Alex_Gaynorfijal: you need a new strategy for it, I think15:17
fijalsort of15:17
kenaan_12antocuni default 11d4dee87e47cc 15/pypy/module/_io/: make sure to flush all _io streams when we exit the interpreter15:27
kenaan_12antocuni default 114867e38be6fb 15/pypy/module/_io/: refactor the autoflush of streams: we cannot keep a set of w_iobase instances, else they would be never collecte...15:27
kenaan_12antocuni default 11599b70ca76ec 15/pypy/module/_io/: merge heads15:27
antocuniarigato: if case you are interested in how I solved the weakref issue, look at 4867e38be6fb15:27
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kenaan_12fijal speedup-list-comprehension 11a3b63091cb8c 15/pypy/: store sizehint on listobjects15:37
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Alex_Gaynorfijal: that doesn't seem right to  me, this should be a new strategy IMO15:38
fijalwhy?15:40
Alex_Gaynorthere's now a sizehint attr on every class, even though it isn't used 99% of the time15:40
Alex_Gaynoron every list*15:40
Alex_Gaynorit's at the totally wrong abstraction IMO15:40
kenaan_12fijal speedup-list-comprehension 11de49996d2864 15/pypy/objspace/std/listobject.py: oops, a missing case15:40
fijalstrategy does not have attributes15:40
Alex_Gaynorsure they can15:41
fijalnot really15:41
fijalwe don't instantiate them15:41
Alex_Gaynoryou can15:41
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Alex_Gaynorthere's no reason you can't have SizedStrategy(n)15:41
fijalthat's more of a waste15:41
fijalbecause you'll have a strategy per listobject15:42
fijalwhich is bigger than 1 word15:42
Alex_Gaynoryes, but the strategy gets thrown away as soon as you append one list15:42
Alex_Gaynorbecuase you transition it to IntStategy etc.15:42
fijalI guess so15:44
fijala bit annoying15:44
fijalbut indeed15:44
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CIA-8003Daid 07roundup * 10#1045/Win32 crash of the JIT: (log message trimmed)16:07
CIA-80Partial success. This crash happens randomly it seems. But always with the same16:07
CIA-80Assertion backtrace:16:07
CIA-80Progress[speed:48]16:07
CIA-80Progress[speed:49] * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue104516:07
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fijalarigato: can you reproduce the crash reported in 1045?16:27
fijalbytecode corruption, nice16:29
antocunibah16:32
antocuniI may be wrong, but the objspace initialization process is a complete mess16:33
antocuniit also looks buggy, because e.g. sys.Module.init() gets called twice16:33
fijalit is a mess16:34
fijalwe even have issue on that16:34
antocuniuhm, maybe in this particular case the problem is that we call appexec when the space is still not fully initialized16:35
fijalwe need tracker gardening at some point16:37
antocuniseems not16:37
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fijalarigato: when we append to the list we can only resize it upwards right?16:42
fijalwe won't downscale it in any way16:42
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arigatoyes16:43
Alex_Gaynoroughantocuni: once upon a time benjamin had a branch to refactor intialization, I don't think it was ever finished th16:46
fijaluh16:46
fijalAlex_Gaynor: he did clean up a bit16:47
fijalok16:47
fijalso who thought listing opcodes by hand in opcode.py is a good idea :/16:47
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stakkars_howdy!16:51
fijaluh16:53
fijaljitviewer is broken :/16:53
fijalAlex_Gaynor: we should likely fix it before the tutorial16:53
Alex_Gaynorfijal: Yes, I think so.16:54
arigatostakkars_: re-hi!16:55
stakkars_arigato, fijal: has somebody worked on win64 meanwhile?16:55
arigatofijal: or have a version of jitviewer that is known to work with pypy 1.816:56
fijalstakkars_: not publically16:56
fijalarigato: when were labels introduced?16:56
arigatobefore16:56
arigatoI think16:56
stakkars_arigato: I'm currently in a medium project, but will go to PyCon16:56
fijalthen it's the same task really :)16:56
stakkars_arigato: and sprint there, and put the rest of March into PyPy.16:57
Alex_Gaynorfijal: defnitely befroe 1.816:57
arigatostakkars_: ok16:57
stakkars_I'd like some people who want to help with that.16:57
fijalstakkars_: we all would like some people who care about windows :/16:58
fijalstakkars_: unfortunately there are not that many16:58
fijaleven though pypy seems to be popular on windows16:58
fijalmeh16:58
fijalmeh meh16:58
stakkars_tha's the crux. winnows people want to use it, but no more16:58
exarkunFairly typical16:59
exarkunWindows is more popular amongst users than developers16:59
stakkars_is win32 so far clean at the moment, everything working?17:00
stakkars_it is crucial to get win64 merged ASAP. Will start at PyCon17:01
fijalstakkars_: win32 is not so clean17:01
fijalarigato: uh, you also broke some jit tests17:02
stakkars_still not! It would be easier not to work around stuff that does not work in 32bit17:02
fijalthat pass r_longlong to jit merge point17:02
fijalhttp://buildbot.pypy.org/summary?category=win3217:02
fijalstakkars_: ^^^17:03
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stakkars_hum, well, not that much, but some quite boring things.17:06
stakkars_something is especially broken with buildbot. Many "access denied" errors17:06
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stakkars_I think it would be good to clean that totally on win32 as a starting point17:09
fijalstakkars_: yes17:09
fijalstakkars_: but I'm afraid if you don't do it, chances are noone will17:09
stakkars_:-(17:09
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stakkars_have no time now17:10
fijalyou'll find it in a similar state when you have time :)17:10
fijalfor good or bad17:10
stakkars_different topic:17:10
stakkars_to interface to some libraries, is it best to use ctypes in general?17:11
fijalyesish17:11
stakkars_modulo the things which have better support I think.17:12
stakkars_but to attach to PyGame, or QT? What is your advice?17:13
stakkars_what GUI has best PyPy support? (or vice versa)17:13
stakkars_I would love to call a monster like QT from PyPy, but no idea how difficult it is to run PySide under PyPy.17:14
lucianstakkars_: pyside generates Cs, it'd have to go through cpyext. might not work, and if it does would be slow17:15
stakkars_what GUI stuff do people use with PyPy, after all17:15
lucianpeople don't :)17:16
lucianGtk is more likely to happen sooner, but would also require quite a bit of work17:16
lucianthere's http://code.google.com/p/pygir-ctypes/, which may work for Gtk17:16
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arigatofijal: r_longlong to jit merge point: oups17:19
stakkars_lucian: well, I'm very much in favor of QT, for the looks and features.17:21
lucianstakkars_: sure, but binding to C++ is hard in general17:22
stakkars_maybe a GUI does not need to be attached directly by PyPy, if there17:22
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fijalstakkars_: I would go and call QT via CPYthon in-process or out-of-process17:22
lucianstakkars_: if you wish to write your own binding, look at QMetaObject or KDE's Smoke17:23
fijaleither by embedding CPython using ctypes or externally17:23
stakkars_could be some bridging code. PyPy would do the computation-heavy stuff.17:23
fijalstakkars_: have you seen my blogpost about matplotlib?17:23
lucianstakkars_: there was an example of PyPy calling CPython's Qt ofer rpyc i think17:23
stakkars_fijal: yeah yeah, that sounds pretty good.17:23
luciani think http://morepypy.blogspot.com/2009/11/using-cpython-extension-modules-with.html17:24
fijalfor some definition of "good"17:24
stakkars_phantastic if that works. If I can tie CPython together with PyPy, that's all good for an application.17:25
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stakkars_out-f-process would be even nice, to have a stateful worker process in PyPy17:26
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lucianyeah, i'd be less likely to segfault tooo17:27
stakkars_fijal: matplotlib? No, will look into that. Hey, fun!17:27
kenaan_12arigo default 119ba62b41a086 15/pypy/jit/: Fixes.  Sorry.17:28
kenaan_12arigo default 11b8aed975987f 15/pypy/rlib/debug.py: Fix.17:30
kenaan_12arigo default 1155fd1d7090fb 15/pypy/translator/sandbox/test/test_sandbox.py: Fix this test17:32
arigatohakanardo_: can you (again) have a look at issue1045?17:36
arigatoit's a general optimizer-failing-an-assert issue17:36
arigatoI could reproduce it easy on linux3217:37
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arigatothe failing assert is optimizer.py:99:17:37
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arigatoself.level == CONSTANT, but other.level != CONSTANT17:38
arigato(actually other.level == LEVEL_UNKNOWN here)17:38
CIA-8003arigo 07roundup * 10#1045/Win32 crash of the JIT: 17:40
CIA-80It's a general optimizer-failing-an-assert issue. I could reproduce it easy on17:40
CIA-80linux32. The failing assert is optimizer.py:99: self.level == LE ... * 14https://bugs.pypy.org/issue104517:40
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amaury_PySide seems to compile with pypy17:48
Alex_Gaynoramaury_: does it have tests/demos we can try?17:48
amaury_there is a test/ dir with lots of things17:49
amaury_still compiling...17:49
amaury_ah, the CMake files build .so files17:50
amaury_not .pypy18.so17:50
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amaury_bah18:04
amaury_TypeError: object.__new__(ReduceOption) is not safe, use ReduceOption.__new__()18:04
amaury_Segmentation fault18:04
Action: amaury_ -> out18:04
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stakkars_looking into different UI approaches, PySide seems to be quite fine.18:26
stakkars_PyGame, too, on the other hand.18:26
stakkars_None of them enforces tight binding to PyPy, if bridging over Cpython works fine.18:27
weirdoarigato, how's the stm-gc?18:29
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weirdodoes it work with non-STM?18:29
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arigatoweirdo: yes, slowly18:40
weirdook18:40
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namnthi, i'm helping with the SF Python Meetup group. we're organizing a pre PyCon meetup and soliciting for half hour talks.20:00
namntif you happened to stay in SF the week of PyCon 2012, would you like to attend the meetup and/or give us a talk? ;)20:01
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arigatonamnt: hi!  could you post it to the pypy-dev list?20:09
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kenaan_12amauryfa default 1113ea80daa6d4 15/pypy/module/cpyext/include/: cpyext: add pymath.h and a definition of Py_HUGE_VAL.20:19
kenaan_12amauryfa default 11db6f7731ed5f 15/pypy/module/cpyext/: cpyext: implement PyUnicode_Tailmatch20:19
kenaan_12amauryfa default 117bf5725d49fd 15/pypy/module/cpyext/api.py: cpyext: add PyFrozenSet_Type20:19
kenaan_12amauryfa default 1116b015b252c3 15/pypy/module/cpyext/unicodeobject.py: cpyext: add PyUnicode_GetMax()20:19
kenaan_12amauryfa default 114f01039bfe04 15/pypy/module/cpyext/: cpyext: implement remaining Py_UNICODE_IS* functions20:19
kenaan_12amauryfa default 116cc0977ede36 15/pypy/module/cpyext/: cpyext: add PyCode_Check(), PyCode_GetNumFree()20:19
kenaan_12amauryfa default 1133f342e61049 15/pypy/module/cpyext/: cpyext: add PyEval_EvalCode()20:19
kenaan_12amauryfa default 1191960d426061 15/pypy/module/cpyext/: cpyext: implement PyRun_StringFlags()20:20
kenaan_12amauryfa default 11116c15429aa4 15/pypy/module/cpyext/: cpyext: Implement PyEval_MergeCompilerFlags()20:20
kenaan_12amauryfa default 11f50a42098ae3 15/pypy/module/cpyext/eval.py: Translation fixes20:20
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namntarigato: thanks. just did it.20:53
timotimoarigato: your results with the STM branch are amazing. very well done so far!20:58
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Omni|WorkI'm really annoyed with this page: http://pypy.org/py3donate.html21:02
Alex_GaynorWhat about it?21:02
Omni|WorkI donated money to a project, and after several days my donation has yet to show up in the total.21:02
Omni|WorkI'm wondering if it ever will.21:02
Alex_GaynorUnfortunately that bar is updated manually.21:03
Omni|WorkAhh. :-/21:03
Alex_Gaynoryes, it's not great :(21:03
Omni|WorkThe lack of feedback is disconcerting. And the positions of the bars influenced my decision to donate.21:04
Omni|WorkOh, well.21:04
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Fluxidww yeah!21:05
Fluxidwrong channel, sorry21:05
Omni|WorkAlex_Gaynor: Thanks for the information and acknowledgement that the situation was less than ideal.21:06
Alex_Gaynorfijal knows how to update the numbers, I'll ask him to do so21:07
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Omni|WorkAlex_Gaynor: Thanks! :-)21:10
amaury_cpyext export 425 functions21:16
amaury_exports21:16
Alex_Gaynorcool21:17
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amaury_Supporting PySide looks a bit difficult21:18
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amaury_subclasses of int with custom tp_new...21:19
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Alex_Gaynorsigh, why do people do these things21:20
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fijalarigato: hey?21:21
Alex_Gaynorfijal: hey, can you refresh the donation numbers?21:21
fijalyes21:22
Alex_Gaynorthanks21:22
fijalexcept there are no new numbers21:22
amaury_Alex_Gaynor: Enum types21:23
amaury_(re: subclasses of int)21:23
Alex_Gaynoramaury_: but does it have to be C ;021:23
Alex_Gaynorfijal: no numbers on either one?21:24
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fijalno21:26
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arigatofijal: pong21:28
arigatofwiw it takes at least a week before we even *see* new numbers, no?21:29
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harrisoni wonder what happened to make lac disappear21:31
arigatoI believe she was unwell in january21:32
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Alex_Gaynorfijal: Check what ASM G++ generates for http://paste.pocoo.org/show/555829/22:19
fijalcan you paste it?22:20
Alex_Gaynorfijal: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/555831/22:20
Alex_Gaynorhow on earth is a human supposed to debug this :/22:20
fijalthose are just calls22:21
fijalanyway sounds like we're much faster than this22:21
Alex_Gaynorfijal: just calls, as long as you know what "_Znwm" is22:22
fijal:]22:22
fijalwell22:22
fijalwe don't have two calls for this, do we?22:22
Alex_Gaynordunno, let me see22:23
fijalAlex_Gaynor: can you write a benchmark?22:23
fijalI'm lazy ;-)22:23
fijalwe have 0 calls I'm sure22:23
fijalI'm also thinking about fixing jitviewer22:23
kvdahey Alex_Gaynor, fijal, quick question - do Google Checkout and Paypal have total donations numbers for each of the projects? 22:24
fijalkvda: as in "are they up to date?"22:24
kvdaYeah22:24
kvdaFor example if a donation comes through, is there a total that's updated?22:25
Alex_Gaynorfijal: .3s for GCC and 1s for us22:26
exarkunkvda: When someone manually updates it22:28
dmalcolm$ c++filt _Z1fl22:30
dmalcolmf(long)22:30
kvdaexarkun, is that done frequently?22:30
dmalcolmc++filt is part of binutils fwiw22:30
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kvdaThe reason I'm asking is because I'm looking into automating the process a little. But if the numbers are entered manually even on GCheckout and PayPal sides, then I'm not sure if there's much benefit22:32
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: can I have code?22:43
fijalAlex_Gaynor: that's weird ;-)22:43
fijalkvda: week-two22:43
fijalkvda: what are you looking into automating?22:43
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: cooode22:46
kvdafijal, sorry, automating the donation progress bars on pypy.org22:47
fijalkvda: oh ok22:48
fijalkvda: it all depends22:48
fijalkvda: generally both paypal and google checkout provide you with a post "donation has been received"22:48
fijalso it's "easy" to automate if you have a fully fledged web server22:48
fijalcurrent pypy.org is a set of static pages, so it would be hard22:48
fijalbut peopel asked us many times for automation on this layer22:49
kvdaYeh I wouldn't try for the current site, but for pypy-site.ep.io22:49
fijalyeah22:50
fijalsounds very good to me22:50
fijalkvda: I'm starting to ponder how we can move pypy.org there22:50
fijalmaybe launch new.pypy.org or so?22:50
kvdayeah that sounds good to me. 22:50
fijalafter pycon though please :)22:51
kvdanot a problem22:51
kvdaI was hoping for an easy solution, ie plug into GCheckout API and get the total number from there22:52
kvdabut it sounds like local record keeping might the way to do it22:52
fijalno, you cannot do that (I think)22:54
fijalAlex_Gaynor: eh22:55
fijalAlex_Gaynor: allocating is much slower :/22:55
fijalother than that22:55
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MostAwesomeDudefijal: Are there any important things that need to get ported out of C extensions and into pure Python? I was thinking PIL, but maybe you've got a wishlist already.22:56
fijalMostAwesomeDude: I'm a happy man sitting on a bench ;-)22:56
fijalnot personally at least22:56
fijalbut I'm sure there are people out there22:56
fijalit's not the porting that's hard22:56
fijalit's maintaining22:56
exarkunMostAwesomeDude: How about Twisted's I/O Completion Ports wrapper22:57
exarkunSo iocpreactor works on PyPy22:57
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exarkunfijal: btw, we merged the epoll ticket, not sure if you noticed22:57
MostAwesomeDudeexarkun: For intensive porpoises, I don't have a Win32 machine.22:57
fijalexarkun: I did not22:57
fijalexarkun: so does epoll reactor works on pypy now?22:57
exarkunMostAwesomeDude: Intelligent decision.22:57
exarkunfijal: I haven't actually tried!  But it should.22:58
MostAwesomeDudeAlso doesn't IOCP only work on older machines, and not Vista+?22:58
exarkunI guess I could make a trivial test in 2 seconds22:58
fijalexarkun: what's the status of nightly tests?22:58
MostAwesomeDudeOr is that WFMO? I don't really know.22:58
fijalexarkun: maybe we can sit and make it green on the sprints or around?22:58
exarkunMostAwesomeDude: As far as I know, IOCP is still the thing.22:59
exarkunfijal: Didn't I already promise to sit with you and do something else at the sprints22:59
fijalexarkun: maybe22:59
fijalexarkun: you would remember if it were important22:59
fijalexarkun: stm stuff maybe22:59
fijal?22:59
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bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/own-macosx-x86-32/builds/81623:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-64/builds/24923:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-32/builds/106823:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/cpython-2-benchmark-x86-64/builds/2423:00
bbot2Started: 15http://buildbot.pypy.org/builders/jit-benchmark-linux-x86-64-2/builds/7623:00
MostAwesomeDudeHm. So IOCP would also be The Thing on AIX and Solaris? Curious.23:00
MostAwesomeDudeexarkun: Anyway, you'll have my axe during PyCon. Feel free to shove me onto this if really necessary.23:00
fijalAlex_Gaynor: ping?23:01
exarkunfijal: I'll check my logs later.  Anyway, yea, we could do something.  Though I feel like most of what's left is tedious/stupid stuff.23:01
exarkunMostAwesomeDude: AIX?  Solaris?  Huoa?23:02
fijalexarkun: it's just that if it's green I can make it someone's else problem23:02
exarkunfijal: indeed23:02
fijalMostAwesomeDude: pypy does not support neither AIX nor solaris23:02
MostAwesomeDudeexarkun: According to WP, IOCP is present on those OS's as well. I gather that Twisted doesn't care about those platforms though.23:02
exarkunfijal: Anyway yea, epoll seems to work.23:03
exarkunfijal: for 'twistd -n --reactor epoll web' at least23:03
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exarkunMostAwesomeDude: hilariously ridiculous.23:03
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MostAwesomeDudeHey, now we can go blow away the other web benchmarks.23:03
fijalexarkun: cool23:03
fijalexarkun: can you run some twisted's tests please?23:03
exarkunMostAwesomeDude: I _think_ that wikipedia page is full of crap.23:05
exarkunIt seems to be based on a superficial, incorrect reading of some dense documentation for some obscure platforms nobody gives a crap about23:05
MostAwesomeDudeexarkun: I'd like to think so!23:05
exarkunfijal: sure23:05
MostAwesomeDudeIt fits with my feeling of WP as full of crap.23:05
exarkunHeh23:06
exarkunfijal: lots of things passing so far - no colorized output though!  I remember that worked at some point, I wonder why it doesn't now.23:06
exarkun(I am using some random nightly from a few months ago, probably)23:06
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fijalexarkun: okey23:07
exarkunSome tests hanging, so full run will take a while.  I'm goin' to dinner, meanwhile.23:07
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MostAwesomeDudeI'm off to class.23:08
MostAwesomeDudefijal: Lemme know if there's anything that I can translate; doing library maintenance is way easier than hacking PyPy core. :323:08
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fijalMostAwesomeDude: lxml probably23:10
MostAwesomeDude'k!23:11
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: ok23:14
fijalAlex_Gaynor: if I *actually* compile it in one function23:14
fijalit becomes23:14
fijaladdq(%rdx), %rax23:14
fijaladdq$8, %rdx23:14
fijalcmpq%rdx, %rdi23:14
fijaljne.L823:14
fijalwhich is pretty efficient23:15
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: I think it depends23:25
fijalAlex_Gaynor: hm23:25
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fijalAlex_Gaynor: I have no idea why you got the asm you got23:25
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harrisondomo roboto mr arigato]23:46
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timotimowhen amaury said supporting pyside could be "a bit difficult", what does that mean?23:49
timotimomost of the things pypy does are "a bit difficult", but still work really well23:49
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